@AVLinux wrote:
I was suggesting maybe all should use the square

I think it is not a good idea. Different icon means different mode: Bezier or Linear.
If Phyllis, Andrew-R, or other coder can increase the size of the Diamond icon it would be better, I think.

Please don't think I was saying your suggestions were 'useless' they do work and as always your are kind to share your time and expertise. I should have been more clear that once I switched to 'linear' from 'bezier' the change in icon shape from diamond to square was such a big improvement already that I was suggesting maybe all should use the square. It appears Phyllis is looking into make the icon sizes adjustable and if that becomes possible that will fix the issue for everybody once and for all.

I want to remember that there are two type of Autos keyframe: Bezier and Linear mode.
The first one use a diamond icon, the second one use a square icon.

Thanks so much, that looks very promising!

An issue has been opened on MantisBT. See:
https://cinelerra-gg.org/bugtracker/view.php?id=636

Well that is too bad, your suggestions will help somewhat but are more workarounds than solutions. If I set the keyframe mode from 'smooth' to 'linear' then the node point icon changes to a slightly larger square icon that is acceptable and easier to grab. In my opinion since the node points are identified by their colors they should all be the same sized square icon and they should be a significant number of pixels to be easily grabbed by various mouse cursors in all keyframe modes. In short I think the solution is simply a slightly larger square icon. I don't want to go back and forth to sliders and different selection modes, I want to just keep clicking and dragging on the timeline and continue in that workflow..\

I understand that I do a lot more fade autos than your average user and I don't use the 'mixers' method because I want far more control over the duration of the fades on multiple tracks to manually create longer and shorter dissolve fades, to me this is the number one feature of Cinelerra is that ability to have so much flexibility and control with fade autos, no other NLE lets you create long dissolves so easily!

I challenge you to line up 3 or more tracks on the timeline and then draw 50 fades or so with the keyframe mode set to smooth, I think you will find that out of 50 draws you will miss the node point about 15 times and end up dragging the Video track out of sync and have to Undo it back into position several times. It is extremely frustrating and the reason I'm complaining so strongly about it is because I love this program so much and this is the ONLY issue I have with it but it is a big one..

Thanks for reading and your consideration..

Best, Glen

You can delete an Autos (keyframe), or more, following the steps:
- arm the track where you want to delete Autos (keyframes)
- in the main window, click on "Cut and Paste editing mode" (the I-beam icon)
- on the timeline highlight the area where your keyframe(s) are
- Shift+X shortcut to delete them
Pay attemption if there are Plugin Keyframes in the same highlight area because they will be delete toghether with Autos.
In this case you can UNcheck the Plugin Keyframes on the Overlay window to delete ONLY Autos.

To change the value of the Autos Fade (the Y position only) follow the steps:
- arm the track where you want to change the value of the Fade keyframe
- in the Patchbay click on the arrow on the right of the Track's name to expand the track, so you can see the slider
- in the main window check that "Generate keyframes while tweeking (j)" is disabled
- in the timeline, move the cursor position (Insertion Point) to the right of the Fade keyframe, before the next keyframe (between the two keyframes)
- in the Patchbay, move the slider to change the Fade value: it will only change the value of the Fade keyframe before of the "Insertion point"

If you change the color from the default of pink to white, it is also easier to see.  You do this in the Window pulldown Show Overlays and in that window click on the colored circle on the right hand side and the color wheel comes up for you to change.

Also don't forget that if the track isn't armed you can't remove (or add) node points. Something I often get caught out over when working with multiple tracks and spot a phantom point, obviously accidentally added by me, and it won't delete until I realise I need to arm the track, because I am not working on that track at the time! 😊 

Hi Phyllis! And thanks for the reply! OK, I'll look at the layout size but screen space is already always a challenge..

I will say in general the node point size is also an issue when trying to right click on a node point to 'delete keyframe'. Sometimes it takes a few clicks to get the keyframe dialog to appear.